| LearnJazzPiano.com archives: Chords | |
| Billy -- 03/07/2004, 19:16:43 -- #2190 | |
| Theres a few chords which i find myselfe using and im not sure what they are. Can someone help me identify them? The first note is the left hand, the rest are the right 1)C Eb G A D 2)F Eb G B D 3)C Eb G B D 4)F C F B 5)F Gb A C F 6)D Eb G A D thanks! | |
| Dr. Whack -- 03/07/2004, 20:31:05 -- #2191 | |
| 1 - Cm6/9 2 - F13#11 (no 3rd but still that's what I'd call it) 3 - Cm9(maj7) 4 - not really a chord - perhaps a funky quartal voicing 5 - I suppose you could call it F b2, but it's really more of a rootless voicing for chords like D7#9 or Ab13b9 6 - again, this is more of a rootless voicing for chords like F13#11 or B7#9#5 just my thoughts... | |
| Mike -- 03/08/2004, 06:31:42 -- #2196 | |
| without context they could be anything 1. could be F7, could be an Eb #11 chord of some sort.could be a lot of things. But odds are if you have to bet money that Whacky is right. but without context notes played at the same time are just chords. and you cant really get more specific than that without context. you can not even assume C E G. is C major without the context, could be F major7, could be A-7, could be Ab aug major 7....etc | |
| savage -- 03/08/2004, 11:09:56 -- #2205 | |
| If you consider the left note to be the root, i would say that: 5. is a voicing derived from mixo b2b6 (fifth mode of harmonic minor) or HW diminished. 6. is a phrygian voicing, often called susb9 | |
| smg -- 03/08/2004, 12:49:47 -- #2212 | |
| I'd agree with everybody above re-various interpretations of specific chords,but overall I'd just look at all 6 as being structures over an F pedal;each one uses some of the available tensions/upper structures related to F and more than one has an F7-related tritone.Try this and see what happens: 1.Hold down a pedal F(double it in the bass i.e.F-F one octave apart) 2.Try playing each of those chords melodically over it ie. play each of the notes individually,and if you want hold down the sustain pedal. 3.If what you're hearing is the same as how you're interpreting those chords over each of the LH roots,you've confirmed my hypothesis. Given the fact that a big part of contemporary music is the use of the pentatonic as well as modal concepts,and the C,F,and D roots you're using,probably you're moving in "secondary pentatonic roots" over the pedal(C-D-F=notes 4,5,and 1 of F maj.pent)and harmonizing these with structures built on it as well.The root can be implied rather than actually stated but it still functions as a root in terms of the progression. | |
| smg -- 03/08/2004, 15:30:18 -- #2214 | |
| What's going on here is that,once you set up a root pedal tone,a lot of different "temporary harmonies" can be superimposed over it,relating to it kind of like the way a prism refracts light into different shades.This is something that a lot of late-50's-present music uses.Each of those 6 'defines' a more-or-less specific interpretation of the root with added notes above it functioning harmonically.See which scales/patterns you connect with each of those. | |
| smg -- 03/08/2004, 15:34:36 -- #2215 | |
| Here's some links that deal with this stuff-http://www.outsideshore.com/primer/primer/ms-primer-6-1-1-3.html http://www.smartfarmer.com/mark/education/Polychords.pdf http://www.humboldt1.com/~jazz/us.html | |
| smg -- 03/08/2004, 15:37:12 -- #2216 | |
| This one has a list of scales that relate to these concepts- http://www.jackzucker.com/JazGuitar/lessons/index.htm | |
| smg -- 03/08/2004, 15:38:54 -- #2217 | |
| http://www.jazguitar.net/lessons/Modes.html | |
| 7 -- 03/08/2004, 22:20:03 -- #2224 | |
| Did any of you guys actually play through all these chords? Take 4 for example: Whacky says about #4: "not really a chord - perhaps a funky quartal voicing" The reason it's not really a chord, is because it sounds terrible. I feel like Billy is pulling our collective legs here. Like he's thinking "Let's find the most horrible collection of cacophony and see if these geniuses can make up a name for it". Maybe somebody will stand up and say "I really LIKE the way that chord 'F C F B' sounds", but that's pretty hard for me to imagine. I tried all kinds of different ways to make it work, but failed. What kind of progression is it supposed to be in? What are the surrounding chords - the context of the chord movements relative to this chord? Have mercy! 7 | |
| 7 -- 03/08/2004, 22:22:44 -- #2225 | |
| #3 is commonly seen notated as "CmM9" | |
| savage -- 03/09/2004, 05:41:54 -- #2232 | |
| I don't agree with you 7, #4 can definitely be used as a nice modal voicing (in this case lydian). Listen to Kenny Kirkland, he uses it in his left hand quite often (not in this key though, it becomes muddy). It's all a matter of personal taste i guess... | |
| Dr. Whack -- 03/09/2004, 12:08:12 -- #2255 | |
| and I think the mM thing is confusing...not handwriting or fonts do a good job of distinguishing between case...I would have used a triangle but I didn't feel like hunting down the font :) that quartal thing could definitely be used for a Dm13... I tried to label the chords as literally as possible, making no assumptions about possible different bass notes, except in the cases where I did hypothesize certain assumptions. In those cases of course I assumed. But please remember, "Assume" makes and "ass" out of "u" and "me" I assume I've cleard that up??:) | |
| Billy -- 03/09/2004, 12:50:10 -- #2256 | |
| Thanks for your replies guys! No 7, i am not attempting to pull anyones leg. That chord came from my never-ending quest to make contemporary music not sound so lame. I play keys in a church youth band consisting of a accoustic guitar, lead guitar, bass, drummer, percussion, and congos, and of corse me on keys. The progressions are really simple, so i want to add some coolness to them. The progression i got that chord from went like this: G F G D G So, i replaced the F with the F C B chord in the right, and a F in the bass. Lemme see if i can record a midi of the song for you...i replaced quite a few chords with some of em i asked about. Ok, im gonna upload my midi file now. Mabe it does sound bad and i just dont know? The song is called "lord there is none like you" | |
| Dr. Whack -- 03/09/2004, 14:28:59 -- #2259 | |
| nice job Billy...it sounds to me like that funky quartal thing is just an F chord with a passing tone "B" in the melody...I wouldn't go to the trouble of labeling that chord anything other than F... keep playin man! | |
| 7 -- 03/09/2004, 22:28:50 -- #2275 | |
| Thank you Billy. What Whacky said. | |
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