| LearnJazzPiano.com archives: What chord is this? | |
| ProAce -- 02/02/2007, 11:55:07 -- #32837 | |
| I am playing "Someday My Prince Will Come" and there is a C#dim7. I play a C# in the bass and instead of C# E G A# with the right hand, I play C# E G C and it sounds really good. What chord am I now playing? I want to write it in, but I'm drawing a blank as to exactly what chord that is. Thanks in advance. | |
| Jazz+ -- 02/02/2007, 12:30:37 -- #32837 | |
| I would still label it a C# dim7 You can move any chord tone in a diminsihed chord up a whole step for a more bitting, more modern sound (it's still in the diminished scale). Your chord also resembles a rootless A7#9 voicing... | |
| Jazz+ -- 02/02/2007, 12:31:27 -- #32837 | |
| You altered your C# dim7, that's all | |
| sdm -- 02/02/2007, 12:36:57 -- #32837 | |
| Jazz+ - cool, thanks! I've wondered this for a while -- that is, what can you do with a dim chord. Guess I should have asked Randy but I figured we hadn't gotten there yet. Although I'll listen, should you try to limit the number of tones that you move "out of the chord?" | |
| hepcatmonk -- 02/03/2007, 10:46:31 -- #32837 | |
| Exactly what Jazz+ said... the reason that this works is, in Someday My Prince Will Come, the chord that C#dim7 is leading to is a Dm7. Back in the old days, dimished chords were common because they provided a chromatic bass motion. But check this out...what chord would naturally lead to Dm7? A7! So by raising that Bb to a C, you're actually changing the diminished chord to an A7#9 with C# in the bass... see how that works out and still sounds good?. What you're doing also leads to Dm7, but by way of a dominant chord instead of a diminished chord. sdm, I usually alter every diminished chord I play because the soudn of a diminished chord is usually to consonant compared to the altered dominants that I usually play surrounding it...it doesn't blend. I alter them to taste, but usually only alter one note of a diminished chord so it is still recognizable. Sometimes more...use your ears. | |
| sdm -- 02/03/2007, 10:53:24 -- #32837 | |
| Thanks much hep...I must be ready for this - it makes perfect sense and answers a nagging question. As you say, while the dim is pretty it is a little too pretty sometimes. To the keyboard... | |
| sdm -- 02/15/2007, 12:54:51 -- #32837 | |
| OK, back on this dim chord deal. Trying to use my ears I find I like some forms with a tone moved up a step and others not so much. Does the alteration (choice of tone to move) depend on the underlying tonality or, as hepcatmonk says, on the chord that follows? I have some more work to do of course but you guys are always a great shortcut. I guess if the raised tone is always the #9 then the resulting chord is always the dom chord of a half tone below the tone that was changed. Starting with C dim: C Eb Gb A 1. C Eb Gb B = Ab7#9 w/3 in bass 2. C Eb Ab A = F7#9 w/5 in bass 3. C F Gb A = E7#9 w/7 in bass 4. D Eb Gb Bbb (A) = Cb7#9 w/#9 in bass (C## D# F# A = B7#9) Is that right? | |
| Jazz+ -- 02/15/2007, 13:26:18 -- #32837 | |
| You can look at it that way. But theire are no absolutes because it's all pretty much interchangeable (diminished chords and #9 or b9 dominant chords). Thus the chord that follows and the chord it's coming from is how I decide what to label it. | |
| Jazz+ -- 02/15/2007, 13:27:52 -- #32837 | |
| The block chord method (as shown by Levine) relies heavily on using "tweaked" dimished chords. | |
| Jazz+ -- 02/15/2007, 13:29:19 -- #32837 | |
| In "Drop 2" block chords it's either the alto or the tenor voice of a diminished chord that gets raised a whole step. Either way it's still a V function. | |
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