LearnJazzPiano.com archives: Caravan Scales

Rid -- 06/09/2007, 16:59:21 -- #35398

I am working on “Caravan”, from an arrangement that alternates between C7 and Db7 in successive measures. These 8-note scales have been suggested for improvising over these changes: Over C7: C Db Eb E F G Ab Bb Over Db7: Db Eb E F G Ab Bb Cb So when the chord changes, the only scale change is that  C changes to Cb. These are interesting scales, alright,  but I’m wondering: What is the best way to think about them?  Do they have names? (F harmonic minor with Eb thrown in at no extra cost? Db Lydian dominant with E thrown in at no extra cost?)   Do a lot of improvisers use them on Caravan? Are they used on other songs too? Any insights would be appreciated. Thanks, Ed

superjames -- 06/09/2007, 19:06:04 -- #35398

I usually think of the one you're using over the C7 (as you say) as the 5th mode of the F harmonic minor with the Eb added in to smooth out the tone and a half gap between the Db and the F. I really like the sound of this scale, but it doesn't seem to get talked about much, I wonder why that is?

7 -- 06/09/2007, 20:55:53 -- #35398

According to Scaleopia http://www.geocities.com/scaleopia/8notes.html your first scale is the Spanish Phrygian scale, the 2nd is the 4th mode of the Zirafkend scale. Not that any of this is helpful to you <g>

Jazz+ -- 06/09/2007, 23:45:06 -- #35398

I also play the F Harmonic Minor. And I play it over both the C7 and the Db7 without changing the scale at all. I also dip into the diminshed scale sometimes. Sometimes I play Caravan with 12 bars of C7 sus (mixolydian).

DrJazz -- 06/18/2007, 14:29:01 -- #35398

I agree with jazz+ that it's not necessary to change the scale every time the chord changes, which is quite hard to pull off convincingly and can lead to a rather stilted result. Besides, there's only one note difference between your two scales! The original version of this tune had just one chord for 12 bars - C7b9 - and the bass alternated C and Db - that's where the idea of playing two chords came from. The diminished scale works great - start on E and play tone first...

Rid -- 06/22/2007, 20:03:18 -- #35398

Thanks for the thoughts, guys. Very helpful. Of course, I'm hanging my head in shame, for not recognizing the Zirafkend scale! Ed

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