| LearnJazzPiano.com archives: lack of theory | |
| keyellee -- 08/04/2004, 18:37:58 -- #6260 | |
| I've been playing classical piano for 11 years now..and I love listening to jazz. I'm just blown away by the chord progressions that just seem to "happen" but really make perfect sense. Yet..I feel so far behind when I attempt to improvise on my alto sax (my sax teacher is a great help but i'm still fairly lost) and my piano teacher really admires Art Tatum, but is still a firm believer in the basics of Bach, Beethoven, Mozart, and the like. I've begun to develop a deep appreciation for these composers as well, but I really want a way to understand theory and the components of the music I'm playing. So what is out there that I could do to learn this stuff that frustrates me so much? | |
| mooondancer -- 08/04/2004, 22:29:35 -- #6261 | |
| There is plenty of information on this site to help you out. Browse around and you will find stuff on chords, scales, progressions, etc. Remember it only looks complicated because nobody has explained it to you clearly yet. Once you get a few ideas in your head, it's much easier. Here is some of what I know: Scales and chords are "different manifestations of the same thing." A chord is picking key notes from a scale and playing them at the same time. When you look at a lead sheet, as the chords change, that means your choice of notes (the scale these chords come from) changes at the same time. But certain progressions, such as Dm, G7, Cmaj are special because their scales (D dorian minor, G mixolydian, C major) contain the same notes: ... B C D E F G A B C D E... The only thing different is the notes you pick to make each chord what it is. This progression is called a 2-5-1, and you only need to think of one scale to fit all three chords. One thing the wheel of fifths -- C, F, Bb, Eb, Ab... shows you is the order of 2-5-1s. Cm F7 Bbmaj is one. so is Fm Bb7 Ebmaj, and so is Bbm, Eb7, Abmaj. There are 12 of them. Most jazz tunes are made of these type of progressions. Look around this site and you'll find more. | |
| 7 -- 08/05/2004, 10:31:41 -- #6276 | |
| Listing of Theory Sites: http://www.JeffreeBrent.com/LINKS/theory.html | |
| Jazz+ -- 08/05/2004, 10:37:01 -- #6277 | |
| Go to the library and take out some classical theory books. Study them 3 hours every day for a year and do the excercises at the end of the chapters. There are no shortcuts for learning theory, it's not something you can dabble in and pickup quickly, it is highly academic. After you understand first year theory buy a copy of "The Jazz Theory Book" by Mark Levine and read it for two hours a day for a year and again continuosly do the exercises at the end of each chapter. | |
| Peteboypete -- 08/05/2004, 15:09:59 -- #6289 | |
| I just found this site, so I haven't read very much, but it seems to be laid out in a very similar way to Levine's "Jazz Theory Book." It doesn't have all of the examples, but it covers most of the same ideas (maybe some other ones too). http://www.outsideshore.com/primer/primer/index.html | |
| mooondancer -- 08/05/2004, 16:37:50 -- #6290 | |
| Jazz+, I can't tell if you're joking! "3 hours every day for a year"??? There is NO REASON it should take that long to learn music theory. Basic theory is just how scales and chords are related, and how chords function to create progressions. That's it. As it pertains to jazz, you learn various patterns (chords, arpeggios) to improvise with, and various voicings for the chords. Of course there's lots more to experiment with, but basic theory (everything you NEED) is just that -- basic. | |
| CynBad -- 08/05/2004, 18:14:55 -- #6292 | |
| I have a classical piano background too, and I STRONGLY recommend the book "Metaphors for the Musician - Perspectives from a Jazz Pianist" by Randy Halberstadt. Randy is a GREAT teacher and this book can really help you to learn how to LEARN jazz and how to practice and develop your playing. Also, as suggested above, Mark Levine's books are great too. | |
| bc -- 08/07/2004, 09:33:38 -- #6341 | |
| You know you already have a wealth of information by your classical understanding of scales. The problem is that a classical approach leaves you a little "boxed" (as can any cliched jazz method ) Try going through all the scales you already know starting from different degrees of the scales & play all over your instrument, loud & soft. Knowing loads of theory is fine but in truth the main problem is that when you get to improvise with others you will be hampered if your sense of time is poor so practicing scales with a click really helps as does trying to just tap a beat & keep to records you like. Listening is really the key. When you were growing up you learnt your language by listening & need. Ok to describe what I mean by being "boxed". Take all the scales you know, put on a click & practice them descending & ascending. Try to be as fluent a you can. Oh and music is beautiful - if it ever becomes a chore go & make a cup of tea or go out for a walk. only 2 kinds of practice good & bad! Cheers | |
| smg -- 08/08/2004, 19:20:35 -- #6380 | |
| I'm not around as much these days as I'd like but still wanted to alert people to the files over at "360 degrees" here at LJP that get into this in detail...use the "room map"............. | |
| pphilip -- 08/10/2004, 16:42:21 -- #6428 | |
| Learn a bunch of tunes then go out and suffer for a few years. Make sure you don't have anything to fall back on because you will. | |
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