Art Tatum plays 2004 style line??
smg here-just picked up a great old recording of at solo;at one point in a tune he uses a harmonic/melodic pattern that sounded like something joey calderazzo,etc.might play;1235 followed by a line on the dim..ahead of his time????check him out-what a mthrfckr!!!
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i doubt we'll ever see/hear another one like him...he was absolutely unbelievable....way ahead of his time...
yeah man....you know i remember checking him out a long time ago and not really wanting to get to deep into listening then because i was trying to get myself to hear more modal/post-jc types of stuff;i'd come up listening to a lot of 40's-50's players and wanted to break away from that....but now many years later i really enjoyed hearing him put in all these "20th century classical" chords on tunes like "begin the beguine";plus his time concept with the runs.........it's another case of the "jc listening to sidney bechet while recording stuff like "afro-blue"situation,where a focus on a player's style,musicianship and concept transcends the apparent stylistic polarity involved..i think in reality a lot of this goes on with the master players-they're more into studying earlier influences for this type of thing than studying their peers,players who run the same modern patterns as they do...........
if it's the version of begin the beguine" that i have, it is absolutely mind boggling...i still grin and even chuckle every time i hear it:) those seemingly rhythmically obscure runs are actually perfectly in time...he he...
i remember not really enjoying his playing back when i was into mainly oscar and bill evans...but i just didn't get it....i had to mature first...then...oh man...what a surprise!
i remember not really enjoying his playing back when i was into mainly oscar and bill evans...but i just didn't get it....i had to mature first...then...oh man...what a surprise!
at last some real appreciation for the mind blowing capabilities of this guy... i remember the first time i got hold of one of his live cd's i was blown into oblivion hearing sounds and effects that seemed physically impossible on the piano (the kind of stuff people use sequencers and sinths to produce)but yet he has taken alot of criticism... i remember one of my friends borrowed the cd and returned it to me saying that art sounds like he is just practicing anything rather than playing (well i wish my practice routine could sound as good as that)anyway! just imagine what we would have missed if he had been discouraged from playing his stuff because others (who are entitled to their opinions) didn't like what they heard, i'm so glad he carried on it's a pity his life was so short.....
to quote steve martin; "criticize things you don't know about, be obsequious, purple and clairvoyant"
it aint dance music:)
it aint dance music:)
hey ttt,whats' up man?
thew thing that gets me is the drive he plays with;i decided to do a little more listening to players like him,dolphy,sonny stitt,just cats that had a real strong internal natural time feel,to balance a lot of listening to 2004 pop stuff i'm doing(dealing with the beats specifically)right now-too much drum machine time gets to you(!!)and he just kind of "hurtles" through these stop-time sections.......this is what i was getting into a while back when i posted that thing about listening to rashied ali to develop a relaxed,flowing feel.....real time vs. all the other forms that exist-i.e.4/4 as played by jimmy garrison and elvin or paul chambers and philly joe is a lot different than 4/4 as interpreted in the urban/r+b/pop sector.....it's not just the swing feel involved but a subtle"settling into" a groove that drum machines can't get next to,for all their usefulness and relevance in these styles(i'm getting ready to get one),,,,,,
thew thing that gets me is the drive he plays with;i decided to do a little more listening to players like him,dolphy,sonny stitt,just cats that had a real strong internal natural time feel,to balance a lot of listening to 2004 pop stuff i'm doing(dealing with the beats specifically)right now-too much drum machine time gets to you(!!)and he just kind of "hurtles" through these stop-time sections.......this is what i was getting into a while back when i posted that thing about listening to rashied ali to develop a relaxed,flowing feel.....real time vs. all the other forms that exist-i.e.4/4 as played by jimmy garrison and elvin or paul chambers and philly joe is a lot different than 4/4 as interpreted in the urban/r+b/pop sector.....it's not just the swing feel involved but a subtle"settling into" a groove that drum machines can't get next to,for all their usefulness and relevance in these styles(i'm getting ready to get one),,,,,,
btw whacky-this one has "memories of you","kerry dance","body and soul"....same recording?
mine is from "the tatum solo materpieces" vol 3 (pablo- vinyl) recorded 12/28/53 in la
as for drum machines - don't get one:) - oh well i must say playing with one for years probably did help my time...but i could never get the thing to swing...
as for drum machines - don't get one:) - oh well i must say playing with one for years probably did help my time...but i could never get the thing to swing...
hmmm...let me dig mine out from underneath layers of dust and cob webs and give those a try:)
you know,in terms of being a jazz player i never wanted to deal with it either but (like many of you ljp regulars may remember) i'm involved in making a demo of songs i've written for urban/r+b/pop singers and using it in that context is another matter entirely,where it serves as a framework for the song structure.........
i never had a problem getting a drum machine to swing. the trick is to realize that it is not the machine that needs to swing ... it is you...
just make sure you do not program the machine to do something that gets in your way. if you program the machine to accent beats one and three that is going to make it difficult for you to swing for example. and you might say the machine is not swinging but the bigger thing will of cousre be that you will not be swinging. it is easy to make metronomes swing hard. just set them to click on two and four. if that is the case how could you possably have difficulty making a drum machine swing.
it can be difficult to have them swing and have a "human feel" but that is different subject entirely but not one that can be solved with some drum machine experience. of course it never gets as good as the real thing or there likely would be no more working drummers out there.
just make sure you do not program the machine to do something that gets in your way. if you program the machine to accent beats one and three that is going to make it difficult for you to swing for example. and you might say the machine is not swinging but the bigger thing will of cousre be that you will not be swinging. it is easy to make metronomes swing hard. just set them to click on two and four. if that is the case how could you possably have difficulty making a drum machine swing.
it can be difficult to have them swing and have a "human feel" but that is different subject entirely but not one that can be solved with some drum machine experience. of course it never gets as good as the real thing or there likely would be no more working drummers out there.
to get really good at swing drum machine programing i suggest transcribing swing drum parts and then programing them into your machine... in real time as much as possable. once upon a time i did many such sequences like this and they definetly swung. it is often and illusion that we think we know what the drums are doing in swing situations until we actually sit down and do beat for beat transcriptions.
good point...i keep forgetting i suck:)
i'd be interested in knowing what machines(alessis,boss,etc.)other people here have had experience with and any recommendations..getting ready to shell out some $$ for one.............
the roland r-8 was pretty cool...that's the last one i used...but i couldn't get it to swing if i hung it from a rope...but then again, i suck...
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